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 Asian Aros in the U.S.?

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Wyomingite
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PostSubject: Asian Aros in the U.S.?   Tue Oct 20, 2009 12:40 am

So, watcha all think of these Asian arowanas on Aquabid, from a seller in New York? Didn't think they were legal in the U.S. at all. All in all the price seems too good to be true and the grammar in the ad does not inspire confidence, seems to me someone with the means and connections to pull this off would be a little more professional with their promotion, and it doesn't seem that they'd be sellin' the merchandise on Aquabid. But then maybe I'm too suspicious. Wink

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Mostlycichlids
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PostSubject: Re: Asian Aros in the U.S.?   Tue Oct 20, 2009 10:47 am

Hmm, very fishy and no pics or really any other description. I should email the seller and see whats up!

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saint_felony
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PostSubject: Re: Asian Aros in the U.S.?   Tue Oct 20, 2009 1:43 pm

More than you think, either legal or not have made it into the US. The demand for 'em from both Aquariums and the private folks are INSANE. But so is the cost and paperwork of legally getting one here. Our friends in Canada though are just fine with folks getting them, and US Customs Agents aren't entirely up on what they are, especially I'd imagine if a 4 incher is in with other fishies or otherwise hidden some way.

That being said, I have seen one legal Asian Aro go on Aquabid, but it started at 2k, had photos, paperwork, (photos of the paperwork too) If memory serves it ended around something like 11k

Can you get them? Yes. Is this one? Maybe, and a big maybe at that. Is it legal? "our transactions will remain confidential." Most definitely not.
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Wyomingite
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PostSubject: Re: Asian Aros in the U.S.?   Tue Oct 20, 2009 11:22 pm

saint_felony wrote:
Can you get them? Yes. Is this one? Maybe, and a big maybe at that. Is it legal? "our transactions will remain confidential." Most definitely not.

LOL. My thoughts exaxtly, though I honestly figured it would be a lot harder to get one than you make it sound, saint. And I figure it'd take a whole lot more than $600. Strugglin' with this bein' on the up and up.

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saint_felony
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PostSubject: Re: Asian Aros in the U.S.?   Thu Oct 22, 2009 11:47 pm

While I don't really agree with CB Asian Aros being unavailable in the US, I am also not encouraging anyone to attempt to illegally get one in either. There's at least one legal way that I know of to attempt to do it, but it involves money, time, money, paperwork, money, federal agents and money. Did I mention money?

All of which would still be cheaper than getting busted for violating the Endangered Species Act.

First you'd need someone who lived in Canada or a Canadian mailing address, and to get people to be part of a group purchase, or have a lot of money and a lot of tanks. Wink

One of the importers the fish farm deals with has price lists for Asians.
Standard reds and red/golds sell for about $500 to $750 each (tho I think that's in Canadian), minimum order is for 12. These are from registered, chipped legit breeders. I think the place they come from was called Panda Aquatics.

Greens sell for $250 so I guess you could get a handful of greens to keep costs down. Wink I know they're considered the bottom tier of Aros, but for some reason the green are the ones that appeal to me the most out of the Asians. I haven't seen them in person, so I'm not sure how they rate against the silvers. But I'm getting off topic a bit here.

After that, I don't want to go into detail but, I know of one kid who walked through US Customs and Immigration with a baby komodo dragon. Showing it to people. Telling them it was his pet. Unless you get lucky (or I guess in this case unlucky) most of the customs agents I've helped out in the past don't know much about, aren't really trained on and don't have much in the way of reference materials to know what's what in the way of fish or reptiles. That's from flying in mind you. Never mind that in Canada you can get to it by car.
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Mike D
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PostSubject: Re: Asian Aros in the U.S.?   Fri Oct 23, 2009 11:00 pm

FedEx em.
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67chevelle
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PostSubject: Re: Asian Aros in the U.S.?   Sat Oct 09, 2010 1:42 am

They are illegal. The people who say they are selling them in the US are not. They are in countries where they are legal,and trying to rip you off. I have contacted them on Aquabid and told them I would like to pick one up,not have it shipped. They wrote back to me and said this was not possible as they were not in this country. It's a scam.

As far as just bringing one over from Canada,from what I understand it is not as easy as you would think. The easiest way would be with a small juvi,which are delicate,and still expensive,and sneak it in somehow. From what I understand,the custom agents do know that they are illegal here,and that people here want them. It's not that you couldn't get one in,but they are going to question any live animal someone is trying to cross the border with. Why would you buy something as delicate as a fish there,if you could get it here? The odds of pulling it off are pretty slim. It's not that it does not happen,but you would probably need to pay off a border guard to get one in.

Besides,silvers are the coolest aros there are anyway. Not that I would not take a Asian if I could,but I would still keep silvers and blacks. There is something about the size,shape,and how the head of them looks that makes them the best aros IMO.
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67chevelle
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PostSubject: Re: Asian Aros in the U.S.?   Sat Oct 09, 2010 1:48 am

Check out the people who are supposedly selling them in the US now. The accounts have been suspended or are under investigation. It's a scam that a lot of people here probably fall for.

http://www.aquabid.com/cgi-bin/auction/auction.cgi?fwarowana&1287404387

http://www.aquabid.com/cgi-bin/auction/auction.cgi?fwarowana&1287404387
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Grumpa
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PostSubject: Re: Asian Aros in the U.S.?   Sat Oct 09, 2010 2:51 pm

I can get them across the border from windsor to michigan without a doubt! No troubles there. The rest of it seems to be the hard part to me!

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saint_felony
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PostSubject: Re: Asian Aros in the U.S.?   Sat Oct 09, 2010 3:48 pm

US Customs agents are so overworked, and so pressured on finding obviously illegal things, that unless you get one who just happens to be knowledgeable about animals odds are good you won't get caught, even if you declare it.

Give you an example. One of my mom's students moved over here from Rincah, one of the islands in Indonesia where komodo dragons are native. His uncle, hatched out a handful of what he thought were bearded dragons. He gave one to his nephew when they moved to the US, for him to keep as a pet. This kid walked though customs with it, told the US customs people that it was a bearded dragon and his pet, they signed off on the paperwork for it, and he brought it to his new home.

Turns out, it wasn't a beardie, but instead it was a komodo dragon. The kid kept it for 3 or 4 years until his mother told him he needed to find it a new home since it outgrew it's cage and the kid was letting it have full run of it's room all the time.

There are asian aros in the US. There is an loophole allowing people moving here to be able to bring their pets legally as well as the smugglers from Canada. I've seen a few of them, the Camden Aquarium has the last two that tried coming in through my area.

I totally agree that the ones on Aquabid are most likely a scam, but with some time and money, you could get your hands on one.
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Mostlycichlids
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PostSubject: Re: Asian Aros in the U.S.?   Sat Oct 09, 2010 7:11 pm

Old thread but it brings up some good discussion. Very valid points. these days most customs agents see a fish or a reptile and unless they are very familiar with the animal they have no idea what the hell it is.

The folks on aquabid are idiots, anyone will do anything to make a buck probabally will send you some beat down poor excuse for one even if they were indeed Asians.

Very true Grumpa, when I lived in MI and went over to windsor sometimes wasnt even checked on the way back.

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67chevelle
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PostSubject: Re: Asian Aros in the U.S.?   Mon Oct 11, 2010 9:51 pm

I don't doubt you could get one in here from Canada. I'm sure plenty of people have. But if it is so easy,then why don't more people have them? If they are dumb enough to cross the border with one,and it's so easy to do,then I would think they would be more available.Criminals are stupid. Surely one of them would be bragging about it on a forum. I know people in the US have them. I just don't think getting them in is as easy as some of you think.
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67chevelle
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PostSubject: Re: Asian Aros in the U.S.?   Mon Oct 11, 2010 9:52 pm

Grumpa wrote:
I can get them across the border from windsor to michigan without a doubt! No troubles there. The rest of it seems to be the hard part to me!

What do you mean the rest of it seems to be the hard part?
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saint_felony
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PostSubject: Re: Asian Aros in the U.S.?   Tue Oct 12, 2010 9:21 am

The reason they're not common from the criminal fringe is that they're such a niche thing, as well as a gigantic pain in the balls to care for, keep alive, cost and size.

Think of it from a quick buck point of view. How much of a market is there for an asian aro versus say a few boxes of cuban cigars. Both are legal up there, and if I were a smuggler I'd go with what would be much easier to sell. The people who have and keep asians in the US are generally smart enough to know to keep their mouths shut about what they have just like the people who still keep snakeheads as pets.


What Grumpa was talking about with the hard part, is the actual care of the fish. What he's missing (I'd guess) is that smugglers (unless they're doing it for themselves) like most crappy petstores don't really care about the health of the animal so long as it gets there and sold alive. He, along with everyone else here, not only would be concerned about it getting here, but it getting here healthy, and have a proper setup for it too.

Unless they become legal, I'm never getting the one I want anyhow. I love the green ones, but they're the red headed stepchildren of the asian aro world, so they never ever get smuggled in. Smile
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67chevelle
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PostSubject: Re: Asian Aros in the U.S.?   Tue Oct 12, 2010 10:55 pm

saint_felony wrote:
The people who have and keep asians in the US are generally smart enough to know to keep their mouths shut about what they have just like the people who still keep snakeheads as pets.

Yeah,but I still think one of them would be dumb enough to post pics and brag. Maybe they have ,and the posts get deleted. I know they are surely here. I'm just not convinced they are as common as it seems to be made out to be.
saint_felony wrote:

Unless they become legal, I'm never getting the one I want anyhow. I love the green ones, but they're the red headed stepchildren of the asian aro world, so they never ever get smuggled in. Smile
HAHA! I like the greens too. If I could have 2,one would be a green. The first would be a blue based x back.
And like you,will never have one unless they are legalized. I've gotten too old to deal with breaking the law.
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67chevelle
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PostSubject: Re: Asian Aros in the U.S.?   Tue Oct 12, 2010 11:01 pm

saint_felony wrote:
The reason they're not common from the criminal fringe is that they're such a niche thing, as well as a gigantic pain in the balls to care for, keep alive, cost and size.
No more so than a silver or black. I have a silver and it's no harder to keep than a cichlid. A bit more of a picky eater is all. And from what I understand,they are no more than a couple grand at the most. More than likely less. I have a couple grand,most people do. So maybe it's just me,but I don't see cost being that big of an issue. I'd gladly blow that kind of cash for a Asian Aro,but only if I won't go to jail,or pay a huge fine.

Sorry about all the double posts,BTW. Feel free to combine them.
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Brisch
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PostSubject: Re: Asian Aros in the U.S.?   Wed Oct 13, 2010 8:41 pm

Things arent that hard to bring from canada to the us...trust me
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saint_felony
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PostSubject: Re: Asian Aros in the U.S.?   Wed Oct 13, 2010 9:54 pm

I have crazy permits and whatnot for working with customs and other places for animal rescue and whatnot since we're cleared for sea turtles here. When Asians get caught from being smuggled in (and it's happened three times that I know of in the past 6 years), the larger aquariums practically have knife fights over who gets to keep them.

If I ever find out a green gets busted local to me, I'm bringing a machete. Wink
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