Well, I am a bit upset with the condition of my new Jag. From the careless shipping to the condition he is in. Ok so some have already read my Lounge post which is a quick summary. Now I am a bit concerned with what to do to get him in shape. He is very skinny...almost like a bobble head. He has a big head but noticicabaly skinny. I also noticed some HITH as well as his eyes are sunken in...I am sure it was bad water conditions and malnutrition. I also noticed his gill on the one side is working well while the other is not working well. He has no physical symptons, is eating and swimming around very normal.

I am concerned with his eyes the most, what would cause the sunken eyes and will the get better (normal)? The HITH will heal up I am sure and am hoping his gill will get stronger and is not damaged permanently. Also as you can see my Female is a little over weight...hard to believe I only feed her every two days. Anyway any suggestions or comments...

Oh and this on top of the careless shipping, I am a little upset about the situation.

So I emailed the seller....this is what he said...

My email to him..

Hey a few questions, how long have you had the Jag? I am not pleased with the condition of the fish at all. He has Hole in the head, he is very underweight, almost anorexic and has sunken eyes...to top it off he seems to have gill damage cause he only uses one gill for the most part to breathe. He seems like he has been kept in bad water conditions and been a bit neglected. Now he does have potential but will probabally never reach full potential. I am very unimpressed with his condition...I was expecting to get a nice and very healthy fish.

His reply...

Hello ive had this jaguar when he was medium size....i shipped the fish in very good condition mayb he dosent look in good condition now because he is stress of being more than 48hours in a bag OBVIOUSLY he is not going to look in good condition right away ...its a miracle that fish survived because i thought he was going to die....he was in a 55Gallon Tank with a 405 filter and water change every 2weeks....The fish was never underweight,u saw him in pictures and it is the same fish the thing is ihave a rule with all my fishes that is that when sumone buys one of my fishes i dont feed them 1-2days to make sure that they not going to dirty the water where they are going to be shipped in..that i know of the fish didnt have a hole in the head...when a fish has a hole in the head that is because the owner feeds constantly live food and i never feed my fishes live food...im very sorry for the inconvinience of the shipping but my fish was in healthy condition when i shipped it.



Total BS.

This dude doesn't know what he's talking about. The fish is clearly malnourished. That in and of itself can cause HITH. I would recommend feeding a couple times a day for several days and keep the water extra clean. Don't buy any more fish from that seller...for sure!

For sure I wont...He did join the forum...hopefully he becomes active so we can teach him a thing or two! He goes by bkfishes

From the pics you posted he has gone a lot longer than 24 to 48 hours with out food. I have only seen this from fish who haven't eaten in months. When my GT had internal parasites she didn't eat for 2 months or only ate small amounts of food and she was very close to looking like your Jag. Like DD said feed him a few times a day until he starts packing on some weight and keep the water clean.

If you can, I would isolate that fish.

I've seen may large fish packaged *properly* and sent two day fedex/ups and have made it here perfectly healthy. Oscars, Midas, Goldfish and even a Bala Shark once. Some people can't afford overnight.

I would like to be wrong, but I've never ever seen a fish with sunken eyes like that survive. Does it's head look like an arrow? Is it shimmying any? What about clamped fins? Those are all pretty good indicators that the fish is screwed.

Sunken eyes are often sign of systemic bacterial infection. Stuff like Aeromonas or Pseudomonas.

The thing that worries me with the gills is that it could have been an extremely bad case of flukes. Flukes unchecked will leech out enough protein and fluids that the fish looks emaciated like that too.

See how it goes over the next few days. I don't know the amounts off the top of my head, but one of my books has a pretty good shotgun parasite killing treatment, that if you want I can look up for you.

saint_felony wrote:

If you can, I would isolate that fish.

I've seen may large fish packaged *properly* and sent two day fedex/ups and have made it here perfectly healthy. Oscars, Midas, Goldfish and even a Bala Shark once. Some people can't afford overnight.

I know saint...his email back was bs.

saint_felony wrote:

I would like to be wrong, but I've never ever seen a fish with sunken eyes like that survive. Does it's head look like an arrow? Is it shimmying any? What about clamped fins? Those are all pretty good indicators that the fish is screwed.

Sunken eyes are often sign of systemic bacterial infection. Stuff like Aeromonas or Pseudomonas.

His head does almost look arrow shaped..no clamped fins, in fact heis acting normal for the past three days I have had him so far, eating, moving normal, no physical signs other than what I outlined.

saint_felony wrote:

The thing that worries me with the gills is that it could have been an extremely bad case of flukes. Flukes unchecked will leech out enough protein and fluids that the fish looks emaciated like that too.

See how it goes over the next few days. I don't know the amounts off the top of my head, but one of my books has a pretty good shotgun parasite killing treatment, that if you want I can look up for you.

Yep that would be great....Like I said he seems to be acting very normal and colors are good too as well as fins and behavior....Just looks to have been through a lot.

I hope you'll luck out with him. Maybe he was just neglected, and with some tlc he'll start looking good soon enough.

At least he's in good hands now.

The HLLE isn't too bad from what I can see, he' is major emaciated. Thought I'd point that out. Anyone with any kinda experience with big cichlids could tell ya that fish hasn't eaten in a while. No deformation in the spine or caudal yet. Good sign.

Didn't see what yer feedin' him, MC. If its live food, make sure ya gut load it and/or roll it in vitamins. I'd stay away from any kinda shellfish for now, from Gammarus all the way to shelled prawns.

Has the potential to be a nice lookin' fish, think a little TLC may pull him through.

WYite

Well things are looking up....His coloration is great, besides everything wrong his colors are nice and bold and lots of purple... Anyway I have about 1.5 tsp of salt per gallon....I think it helps with healing and speeds it up, others may disagree with me on the salt discussion... Well other than that I started two meds, been using Metronidazole and Praziquantel for general parasitic treatment and Erythromycin for general bacterial infections on altering days.

Well, I have been keeping an eye on his conditions and his habbits. He seems to be timid and checks the food out but don't eat it. I have not got him to eat a pellet yet, at least not when I was looking. He took in a couple pellets but spit them back out,I am sure cause he is sick. I have also been trying FD shrimp and frozen Brine shrimp. I have seen him take out some feeder goldies I bought.....I am going to get some earthworms tonight and see what he thinks about him.

Now on the good side of things I was looking at him today and he seems to be gaining a little weight already. His poo is normal, there is already a noticible difference in his gill movements and his eyes. His HITH is doing better but his eyes are doing great...even my wife noticed his eyes....not sunken anymore and actually more out than sunken....

Let me tell you I am already attached to the two....He has actually been digging just like the female....believably they are doing great together....but the female has always been pretty docil. Anyway, thought I would share the progress with everyone.

Hurray! I'm glad it just neglect and not some sort of plague.

Between the metronidazole, prazi and erythromycin, if he does have something, he ain't going to much longer.

Good news, MC! Keep up the good work.

Oh man I was so pissed when I got him but he seems to be recovering fast.

Glad to hear it mc!

Great MC! Pretty soon you'll have baby jags swimmin' around, eh?

WYite