My Jack Dempsey Family is About to Get Bigger

Subject: My Jack Dempsey Family is About to Get Bigger Wed Nov 19, 2008 7:36 pm

Well my primary Jack Dempsey Project is about to begin in earnest. I've got three EBJDs that will arrive via USPS tomorrow. They are between 2.25" and 2.5", so hopefully they will be close to being past the die-off stage (plus I bought a 24W in-tank UV Sterilizer for their tank today). These will be paired (when they're older) with some of my Gold JDs to produce double het offspring. The goal will be to eventually produce offspring that will express both the Electric Blue and Gold genes. Some feel that the Gold Gene may mask the Electric Blue, but since my golds display allot of blue spangling, I'm hoping the EB gene will express itself. I'll post some pics of the EBJDs when they arrive.

Wish me luck, Very Happy

Mark

Member Posts : 15

Good luck,

It has been a while since I played around with JD's but I do believe that the Gold will not mask the EB coloration . If I remember correctly the gold allie when crossed with the blue phenotype will express a 25/75 most being EB's

Good Luck

Nice Mark, can't wait to see how it turns out! Good luck, keep us posted Smile

The Turtle Whisperer Posts : 1930

I still haven't seen the ebjds in person around here. The pictures make them look really gorgeous. Hope yours are anyway.

At some point, I'd like to learn more about controlled breeding. Everything that happens right now with the fish is accidental.

It will be interesting to see what will be produced, although it will be a while (est. 18-24 mos. until first F2 fry are produced). Since both of the traits are recessive, and since the few EBXGold breedings that have been documented produced all normal looking fry in the F1 generation, it indicates that the alleles for each trait are found at different loci. I have found no record of anyone producing any F2 fry yet, although I know of three others here in the U.S. that have produced F1 EBXGold fry. Our hope is to trade F1 fry in order to vary the bloodlines as much as possible. The trusty old Punnett Square indicates that 6.25% of the F2 fry should express the EBG (Electric Blue and Gold) Phenotype (Visible expression of recessive trait.) Now what they will look like is another thing altogether. Smile

Mark

Hey mark if you have any extra BGJD or GGJD's kicking around your tank I'd be willing to take a female off your hands! Twisted Evil

Since I'll be having an empty large tank soon I'd love to start a breeding project of my own. I'm not interested in crossing the BG with the GG although it would be cool I'm just looking to produce EBJD or Gold JD's

The Turtle Whisperer Posts : 1930

and if you need a hand finding a home for some of the rejects, let me know as well. Smile

They're Heeeeere! Very Happy

I purchased three, but he sent an extra for good measure (and at $30 ea., that's a heck of a good measure). I put a couple of my small Golds in with them to keep the feeding response high. Within an hour of being in their new tank, all four were following me up and down the glass looking for food when I went into the room. Here are a few pics of the gang. I'll try to get some better ones once they settle in.
My Jack Dempsey Family is About to Get Bigger Eb005

My Jack Dempsey Family is About to Get Bigger Eb005

My Jack Dempsey Family is About to Get Bigger Eb001

My Jack Dempsey Family is About to Get Bigger Eb004

My Jack Dempsey Family is About to Get Bigger Eb007

Mark

Love them!

Wow, those are amazing already! Healthy as well...would be interested on info of where to get some!

sweet

Mostlycichlids wrote:: Wow, those are amazing already! Healthy as well...would be interested on info of where to get some!

you can actually get them all over, most lfs will have

just remember if you intend on breeding to breed the blue with a norm, cause if you breed a blue with a blue the fry will most likey be mutated if they live at all

These came from Yankeebetta on AquaBid. Tim's a great guy, and will do you right. He's also one of the people working on the EBJDXGold breeding project. A couple of other breeders that have high quality EBs (I plan on getting some from both of them too) are Dempseydan and Tampafishman (Tim goes by Yankeejack) on All Things Dempsey :

http://dempsey.6.forumer.com/viewforum.php?f=17

Mark

mahemaheman85 wrote:: just remember if you intend on breeding to breed the blue with a norm, cause if you breed a blue with a blue the fry will most likey be mutated if they live at all

These will be paired with Golds to produce EBJDXGold Hets. The Gold Morph has proven to be as strong as the normals, but you are absolutely correct, EBJD X EBJD currently produces non-viable offspring. That's why most of the serious breeders are trying to bring in as many different "normal" (regular morph) lines (I personally have four) into the EB and Gold bloodlines as possible.

Mark

mahemaheman85 wrote:

Mostlycichlids wrote:: Wow, those are amazing already! Healthy as well...would be interested on info of where to get some!

you can actually get them all over, most lfs will have

Not here in Colorado I have been to 10-15 different pet stores...most don't even have Jack Dempseys at all.

Thanks Mark I will check them out. Maybe an excuse for another 55g for Christmas or my Birthday!

Mostlycichlids wrote:: Thanks Mark I will check them out. Maybe an excuse for another 55g for Christmas or my Birthday!

Sounds like a plan to me! Very Happy

Like I said, if you want to get info from the experts, go to All Things Dempsey. Those are the guys that know their Dempsey morphs. I've been raising various morphs of Boas and Pythons for over thirty years, and these folks look at Dempsey breeding with the same commitment and scientific reasoning. I've got degrees in Biology and Geology, and too many minors to count, and these guys know their genetics, and how to properly "line breed" fish. Most importantly, they want to breed an EB that will be as strong as the normal JD morph.

Mark

Nice I will go over there and sign up! Maybe I can get their banner to put up here as a link.

The Turtle Whisperer Posts : 1930

That reminds me, Mark. I've looked at my books, and it's not quite exactly clear. What specifically am I looking for to sex JDs? I recently took in what I was told was an albino, (or is that what the golds are?) and I think I'd like to maybe attempt to breed it. All my other jds are regular, but I was thinking it be a good way to figure out more of the specifics of the breeding process and the kids would like it too I bet.

saint_felony wrote:: That reminds me, Mark. I've looked at my books, and it's not quite exactly clear. What specifically am I looking for to sex JDs? I recently took in what I was told was an albino, (or is that what the golds are?) and I think I'd like to maybe attempt to breed it. All my other jds are regular, but I was thinking it be a good way to figure out more of the specifics of the breeding process and the kids would like it too I bet.

My bet is that what you have is a Gold JD which is considered by many to be the Leucistic morph. I personally lean more toward it being a hypomelanistic morph, since most true leucistic animals appear nearly pure white displaying almost no pattern or color. My Gold JDs, on the other hand, have a good bit of blue spangling, and a bright red trim on their dorsal fins. They also display a barred pattern when spawning. Also, the Gold morph has normal colored eyes, while an albino would have bright pink or red eyes. Any of these morphs will be a simple recessive trait.

Sexing the Gold morph is a little more difficult than the normal, but still not too difficult. By about 3" the lower gill plate of the female should start displaying large areas of blue coloring, while the male displays little to no blue coloring on the lower half of the gill plate. If you get a chance, post a pic, I'd like to see it.

I hope this helps,
Mark

A quick two week update. All four are doing great. Very Happy

They are getting four meals a day, two Hikari Cichlid Gold Baby, one cube frozen Hikari Spirulina Enriched Brine Shrimp, and one cube of frozen Hikari Blood Worms. They are eating from my fingers, and jumping out of the water to get the Blood Worms. I'll try to post a couple of new pics tomorrow.

Mark

Very nice, sounds like they are nice and healthy. Can't wait to see the updated pics. Thanks for the update, glad to hear they are doing so well. You should consider submitting some of those Dempsey photos for POTM!

They're sooooo pretty!!!!!!!!!! Envious. Razz

Update:
All four EBJDs are doing great, and have put on a good half inch in the past 2 1/2 weeks. The two biggest are now a good 3". Very Happy

They have settled in beautifully, and will actually jump from the water to try to get the cubes of frozen bloodworms and spirulina enriched brine shrimp that they get as two of their meals each day. These they eat from my fingers. So far they have shown none of the timidness and slow growth that EBJDs are notorious for. Here are a couple of new pics I took today.

My Jack Dempsey Family is About to Get Bigger Eb011

My Jack Dempsey Family is About to Get Bigger Eb011

My Jack Dempsey Family is About to Get Bigger Eb010

Mark

They look really happy.Nice!

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My Jack Dempsey Family is About to Get Bigger

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